http://www.msnbc.msn.com/Default.aspx?id=3990134&p1=0
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Discuss.
Brave New Babies
Brave New Babies
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Every now and then I fall out into open air just to feel the wind, rain and everything.
And though the hum and sway gets me down, I'll find the way to peace and openness.
"Robbo" - © Alex (happeningfish)...^5 ^5 v v
Every now and then I fall out into open air just to feel the wind, rain and everything.
And though the hum and sway gets me down, I'll find the way to peace and openness.
"Robbo" - © Alex (happeningfish)...^5 ^5 v v
i'm not really a big fan of designer babies. Soon the rich will be able to buy more talented and healthy babies. Widening the gap expontinially. Your chanes of getting anywhere in life would be greatly limited unless you were wealthy enough to buy the needed features for your child
by the way anyone interested in this watch the movie "Gatica" it's an excellent take on the dark side of this issue
by the way anyone interested in this watch the movie "Gatica" it's an excellent take on the dark side of this issue
"How can we justify spending so much on destruction and so little on life?" Matthew Good
"The white dove is gone, the one world has come down hard, so why not share the pain of our problems, when all around are wrong ways, when all around is hurt, i'll roll up in an odd shape and wait, untill the tide has turned.....with anger, i'm dead weight, i'm anchored"- IME, God Rocket (Into the Heart of Las Vegas) ^ Some say this song is about a terrorists thoughts before 911
"Pray for the sheep" Matt Good
"But it's alright, take the world and make it yours again" Matt Good
I felt it in the wind, and i saw it in the sky, i thought it was the end, i thought it was the 4th of July.
"Hold on, hold on children, your mother and father are leaving, hold on, hold on children your best freind's parents are leaving, leaving,.......*AHHH*! " - Death From Above - Black History Month
"The white dove is gone, the one world has come down hard, so why not share the pain of our problems, when all around are wrong ways, when all around is hurt, i'll roll up in an odd shape and wait, untill the tide has turned.....with anger, i'm dead weight, i'm anchored"- IME, God Rocket (Into the Heart of Las Vegas) ^ Some say this song is about a terrorists thoughts before 911
"Pray for the sheep" Matt Good
"But it's alright, take the world and make it yours again" Matt Good
I felt it in the wind, and i saw it in the sky, i thought it was the end, i thought it was the 4th of July.
"Hold on, hold on children, your mother and father are leaving, hold on, hold on children your best freind's parents are leaving, leaving,.......*AHHH*! " - Death From Above - Black History Month
Gattaca. 
Spelled with only the short forms for the base pairs in DNA: A, T, G and C.
(dammit! I'm done biology. Stop making me think!)
Spelled with only the short forms for the base pairs in DNA: A, T, G and C.
(dammit! I'm done biology. Stop making me think!)
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Every now and then I fall out into open air just to feel the wind, rain and everything.
And though the hum and sway gets me down, I'll find the way to peace and openness.
"Robbo" - © Alex (happeningfish)...^5 ^5 v v
Every now and then I fall out into open air just to feel the wind, rain and everything.
And though the hum and sway gets me down, I'll find the way to peace and openness.
"Robbo" - © Alex (happeningfish)...^5 ^5 v v
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Random Name
- Posts: 10134
- Joined: 8/16/2003, 2:57 pm
- Location: New Finland
This is just another way that humans are destroying natural selection.
Its starting to get a little more then scary. Because who's going to stop it?
Its starting to get a little more then scary. Because who's going to stop it?
-Sarah
Goodbye you liar,
Well you sipped from the cup but you don't own up to anything
Then you think you will inspire
Take apart your head
(and I wish I could inspire)
Take apart your demons, then you add it to the list.
Goodbye you liar,
Well you sipped from the cup but you don't own up to anything
Then you think you will inspire
Take apart your head
(and I wish I could inspire)
Take apart your demons, then you add it to the list.
Axtech wrote:Gattaca.
(dammit! I'm done biology. Stop making me think!)
I KNEW IT LOOKED WRONG!!
But anyways, very good movie
"How can we justify spending so much on destruction and so little on life?" Matthew Good
"The white dove is gone, the one world has come down hard, so why not share the pain of our problems, when all around are wrong ways, when all around is hurt, i'll roll up in an odd shape and wait, untill the tide has turned.....with anger, i'm dead weight, i'm anchored"- IME, God Rocket (Into the Heart of Las Vegas) ^ Some say this song is about a terrorists thoughts before 911
"Pray for the sheep" Matt Good
"But it's alright, take the world and make it yours again" Matt Good
I felt it in the wind, and i saw it in the sky, i thought it was the end, i thought it was the 4th of July.
"Hold on, hold on children, your mother and father are leaving, hold on, hold on children your best freind's parents are leaving, leaving,.......*AHHH*! " - Death From Above - Black History Month
"The white dove is gone, the one world has come down hard, so why not share the pain of our problems, when all around are wrong ways, when all around is hurt, i'll roll up in an odd shape and wait, untill the tide has turned.....with anger, i'm dead weight, i'm anchored"- IME, God Rocket (Into the Heart of Las Vegas) ^ Some say this song is about a terrorists thoughts before 911
"Pray for the sheep" Matt Good
"But it's alright, take the world and make it yours again" Matt Good
I felt it in the wind, and i saw it in the sky, i thought it was the end, i thought it was the 4th of July.
"Hold on, hold on children, your mother and father are leaving, hold on, hold on children your best freind's parents are leaving, leaving,.......*AHHH*! " - Death From Above - Black History Month
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Joe Cooler
Joe Cool wrote:Messing with natural selection or messing with God depending on where your comming from. Either way its bad.
Why is it bad? I mean, we all know it's bad, but why?
You can't go around building a better world for people. Only people can build a better world for people. Otherwise it's just a cage.
--Terry Pratchett
When it's cold I'd like to die
--Terry Pratchett
When it's cold I'd like to die
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Joe Cooler
Well here is one of the many senarios. A group of rich parents "buy" a child who's had all the negitive human traits removed from from their genes. ( Tendancy to be overly aggressive, quick to anger, ect ect. ) All of these characteristics can be found somewhere in human genes. While they dont define how a person lives their life, they do influence that person in one way or the other. While removing these traits may sound good in theory, it would result in predjudice held againts those without modification. People would be hired for a job simply because they have "good genes." Possibilities are endless.
While the above is just an extreme example of why designer babies are wrong, it could eventually happen.
While the above is just an extreme example of why designer babies are wrong, it could eventually happen.
People are already hired for jobs because of their good genes, on many levels. There's the rich who's kids get into all kinds of programs and schools they haven't earned just because daddy threw money at the school. There's the "natural athletes," those naturally gifted at math, music, whatever. Good genes already play a role in a person's life.
The only difference is right now, if I had a child, I couldn't provide the best for that child. Not only would it not get a great start on physical and mental health, it'd get my family's history of diabetes and heart problems. Right now it's just luck of the draw.
How is that fair?
The only difference is right now, if I had a child, I couldn't provide the best for that child. Not only would it not get a great start on physical and mental health, it'd get my family's history of diabetes and heart problems. Right now it's just luck of the draw.
How is that fair?
You can't go around building a better world for people. Only people can build a better world for people. Otherwise it's just a cage.
--Terry Pratchett
When it's cold I'd like to die
--Terry Pratchett
When it's cold I'd like to die
the problem is only the wealthy will be able to afford the designer babies
"How can we justify spending so much on destruction and so little on life?" Matthew Good
"The white dove is gone, the one world has come down hard, so why not share the pain of our problems, when all around are wrong ways, when all around is hurt, i'll roll up in an odd shape and wait, untill the tide has turned.....with anger, i'm dead weight, i'm anchored"- IME, God Rocket (Into the Heart of Las Vegas) ^ Some say this song is about a terrorists thoughts before 911
"Pray for the sheep" Matt Good
"But it's alright, take the world and make it yours again" Matt Good
I felt it in the wind, and i saw it in the sky, i thought it was the end, i thought it was the 4th of July.
"Hold on, hold on children, your mother and father are leaving, hold on, hold on children your best freind's parents are leaving, leaving,.......*AHHH*! " - Death From Above - Black History Month
"The white dove is gone, the one world has come down hard, so why not share the pain of our problems, when all around are wrong ways, when all around is hurt, i'll roll up in an odd shape and wait, untill the tide has turned.....with anger, i'm dead weight, i'm anchored"- IME, God Rocket (Into the Heart of Las Vegas) ^ Some say this song is about a terrorists thoughts before 911
"Pray for the sheep" Matt Good
"But it's alright, take the world and make it yours again" Matt Good
I felt it in the wind, and i saw it in the sky, i thought it was the end, i thought it was the 4th of July.
"Hold on, hold on children, your mother and father are leaving, hold on, hold on children your best freind's parents are leaving, leaving,.......*AHHH*! " - Death From Above - Black History Month
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Joe Cooler
I don't think it is really nesicary. How 'good' a person is at something is relative. If everyone could do Einstien-level math, he wouldnt be such a genius. On the other hand, if few people could get past grade 5, I'd be considered a great. The bar will just keep going up until it will be impossible to BE that good. There would be no pride in being good at something, because everyone would be.
I think once it starts, there will be no stopping it, and thats the dangerous thing for me. We don't want kids that get angry easily, or kids prone to depression. Hell, pretty soon we can just make it easier and get rid of all emotions. Human nature is what makes us all different. If we all had the same perfect feelings, never felt different about anything, what would seperate us from machines?
I think once it starts, there will be no stopping it, and thats the dangerous thing for me. We don't want kids that get angry easily, or kids prone to depression. Hell, pretty soon we can just make it easier and get rid of all emotions. Human nature is what makes us all different. If we all had the same perfect feelings, never felt different about anything, what would seperate us from machines?
Last edited by thirdhour on 1/20/2004, 11:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Oh hell, it's already started. There are currently, as in right now, hundreds of chinese women intentionally delaying birth so their child is born in a "lucky" year.
Do a simple search on google and you'll find that people have already been going hogwild looking for a means to have the best baby. It's already happening, this just produces better results.
The intent is and always has been there. You have done nothing to show that this is bad other than set up a VERY flimsy false analogy (in the middle of invoking godwin's law, no less).
Also, people want their kids to be happy. To be happy means they have to be able to experience a wide range of emotions, ergo the "eliminate all emotion" straw man doesn't hold up. Just because a kid is less likely to fall into a state of personal grief for weeks at a time doesn't mean they won't get the blues when the dog dies, or that they just won't feel anything, nor does it signal the downfall of human nature, and while we're on it, being "less likely" to experience depression is not the same as not ever getting depressed.
You greatly overestimate the power of nature vs. nurture. Look at height. It's clear that height is, to some extent, genetic. But we also know that healthy diet and proper excercise contribute to how tall you'll end up being, just as childhood illness can leave your shorter than you otherwise would have been. Just because you have the genes to be tall doesn't mean you're going to be 6'1 no discussion. There's a lot of room in there.
Do a simple search on google and you'll find that people have already been going hogwild looking for a means to have the best baby. It's already happening, this just produces better results.
The intent is and always has been there. You have done nothing to show that this is bad other than set up a VERY flimsy false analogy (in the middle of invoking godwin's law, no less).
Also, people want their kids to be happy. To be happy means they have to be able to experience a wide range of emotions, ergo the "eliminate all emotion" straw man doesn't hold up. Just because a kid is less likely to fall into a state of personal grief for weeks at a time doesn't mean they won't get the blues when the dog dies, or that they just won't feel anything, nor does it signal the downfall of human nature, and while we're on it, being "less likely" to experience depression is not the same as not ever getting depressed.
You greatly overestimate the power of nature vs. nurture. Look at height. It's clear that height is, to some extent, genetic. But we also know that healthy diet and proper excercise contribute to how tall you'll end up being, just as childhood illness can leave your shorter than you otherwise would have been. Just because you have the genes to be tall doesn't mean you're going to be 6'1 no discussion. There's a lot of room in there.
You can't go around building a better world for people. Only people can build a better world for people. Otherwise it's just a cage.
--Terry Pratchett
When it's cold I'd like to die
--Terry Pratchett
When it's cold I'd like to die
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Joe Cooler
Narbus wrote:The intent is and always has been there. You have done nothing to show that this is bad other than set up a VERY flimsy false analogy (in the middle of invoking godwin's law, no less).
Is this all directed at me because mabye you should point out the "you" your refering to.
It just seems inhuman in a way. Like shopping for all the parts so you can have the perfect baby. Sure, we breed horses so they're the fastest, but they're animals. I think there's just this desire to be 'perfect' that is really strong in our society. WHY do we need to be the best at everything? Isn't love enough? Shouldn't parents be happy with what they get, and love them just the same? Maybe because I'm not even near becoming a parent, I can't talk, but people should just be people. Imagine being a child that has been 'genitacally enhanced'. If you feel great about something, there's always that doubt that 'do I REALLY feel this way or does someone just want me too?' You could never find an identity because you are just someone else's creation.
Having many sports would just become pointless. It would have alot to do with who had the best science put into them instead of who actually put in the most effort. You can argue that genes still have alot of effect now, but there's a reason drugs are illegal in sports.
Having many sports would just become pointless. It would have alot to do with who had the best science put into them instead of who actually put in the most effort. You can argue that genes still have alot of effect now, but there's a reason drugs are illegal in sports.
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Joe Cooler
Narbus wrote:I disagree with you. I don't believe you've shown me any reason for this to be wrong.
Ok here are my reasons.
If the option to select your childs appearance and abilities is ever realized then the birth of human life might become very consumer driven. Paying high sums of money would give you the perfect child so to speak. If this were to happen then the idea that a couple must have a "beautiful, or smart" child would occur. Creating life shouldnt involve programming a child to fit your wants.
Who knows mabye you think my argument is garbage but thats my view point, educated or not.
